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rocket Posted on 23/06/2012 07:19 PST v Chanrai...no brainer isn't it ?	Report Message \| Email Message To A Friend \| Reply To Message

If there was a poll on here, surely 99 out of 100 would vote PST....you always get 1 person on here who wants to be different. So a lot of the creditors are Pompey fans so surely most of them would rather be rid of this link to the sordid past and start afresh with the PST ?
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blueinbrum Posted on 23/06/2012 09:20 PST v Chanrai...no brainer isn't it ?	Report Message \| Email Message To A Friend \| Reply To Message


If only it was that simple!!
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appleton_out Posted on 23/06/2012 09:47 PST v Chanrai...no brainer isn't it ?	Report Message \| Email Message To A Friend \| Reply To Message


It's too early to say really without seeing the PST bid. Although, from the limited information received yesterday it isn't really a PST bid. Until the High Net Worth Individuals are revealed and the actual PST share in any takeover is established then I'll reserve judgement. If the PST share is considerably lower than that of the HNWI, thus leaving them with no real boardroom influence, how many people that pledged a grand will then have second thoughts? The last thing I want is Chainrai taking over again, but the only thing I will say in his favour is that were PFC to, for whatever reason, encounter any unenvisaged costs outside of the business plan, Chainrai is able to finance a seven figure sum immediately whereas I'm not sure the PST bid can, leaving us potentially staring back down the barrel of administration. Again. But as I've said, until the actual details of the community bid are publicised there are too many unknowns to make an informed choice. Which is why I'm surprised that with less than 48 hours until the creditors meeting and with the bid completed, it's still not been revealed. It smacks of the decision to release a share plea without telling people how much the shares cost! Another Supporters Direct gem, perhaps?
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the_riddle Posted on 23/06/2012 10:33 PST v Chanrai...no brainer isn't it ?	Edited On: 23/06/2012 18:34 Report Message \| Email Message To A Friend \| Reply To Message


A_O - As I understand it, the PST bid planned structure would mean PST could still be the majority shareholder, so if it was to succeed your first point wouldn't necessarily materialise. [edit: I should have added that whilst this is the proposed plan it's still subject to a few factors such as the number of pledges fulfilled for example]. The bid team have not really had dealings with SD for some time now mostly on the basis that this bid is way beyond the advice offered by SD - that's why professional advice has been sought from professionals within the Pompey community. The proposal only went to Birch yesterday and if it looks like it can be successful a full share prospectus would then be released. I can only assume (I don't know for sure) the details of the bid have not been widely released yet as the creditors should find out from Birch what it is before the wider media. It's always been a probelm for the Trust being a party trying to bid which all other parties can do in private, but knowing the Pompey fans want to know what's going on. You have to remember when Portpin put in their proposal the details of the actual bid were not revealed for a couple of weeks. At worst you'll know the details by Monday. The important thing is the bid's in, it's credible and it's being taken seriously, not knowing the details (as I don't either BTW) is a small price at this stage in the scheme of things. One last point, you say Portpin could summon seven figure sums if needed for the club - the truth is they wouldn't. If you look closely at their bid it doesn't really involve any Portpin money from the off. The £500,000 would be recouped asap from the parachute payments. Portpin don't want PFC, they want money and investing to get that might be said to fluff up the PR, but the reality is quite different. If you've not read the Telegraph's articles on this, then well worth a look (see link). Hope that helps inform some of your points where I've been able to with the limited info I have. Link: Telegraph
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appleton_out Posted on 23/06/2012 10:58 PST v Chanrai...no brainer isn't it ?	Report Message \| Email Message To A Friend \| Reply To Message


Cheers, Riddle. I was under the impression that the PST would be a minority shareholder to the HNIW, if this isn't the case I'm very happy to be corrected. A propos the offer, I appreciate that out of propriety the creditors should really receive the details from the administrator, but as the bid's been finalised it won't make any difference in the wider scheme of things if someone comes out and says 'the offer is Xp in the pound, with X offered to Chainrai' etc.(even if it's anonymously leaked ). As you say, it took 2 weeks for Birch to compile his offer from Portpin(nice work if you can get it, but I digress) so I would have thought it unlikely he'll have something ready to put to creditors in time for the meeting on Monday. At least if they have the outline of the offer in place they've got something else to consider when voting on Portpin's derisory insult of an offer. Re: the ability to raise urgent finance, it was only hypothetical but in, say, 6 months time with a new owner in place PFC have cashflow issues to the tune of a million, Portpin's choice is to pay it or put the club back in administration. The Trust's choice would unfortunately be limited to the latter. I've read the Telegraph article, nothing we didn't know but a good read nonetheless for those not up to date with what's happened/happening here. I'd be interested to know what Birch's impressions are. Being legally obliged to secure the best deal for creditors as a whole, he'd surely have to go with the PST bid as long as it's over 2p in the pound unless Chainrai improves his and agrees to reduce his supposed debt by at least as much as the PST have offered him. Knowing that Chainrai'll reject any PFC offer, the best I can see happening is us exiting admin without a CVA and taking the massive penalty. No pain, no gain.
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zorba Posted on 23/06/2012 12:28 PST v Chanrai...no brainer isn't it ?	Report Message \| Email Message To A Friend \| Reply To Message


If the Trust's bid is successful (which I hope it is) the future has to be when potential purchasers come in (as they will) that the Trust go for a Swansea scenario wherebye they have a 20 per cent stake in any future ownership deals.
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the_riddle Posted on 23/06/2012 13:36 PST v Chanrai...no brainer isn't it ?	Report Message \| Email Message To A Friend \| Reply To Message


I think it's a shame people think we have to have outside purchasers coming in down the line as we the fans can't run this thing properly ourselves. For a start the high net worth people are 'investors' to the community company and would bring skills to the table. This belief that we need to have other 'uber businessmen' seems to always overlook the fact so many of our previous owners have said they were that, yet have not 'invested' what people thought, they've either loaned the money or more often taken out a loan against the club in the first place. CSI supposedly had money, all that money enabled them to do was stick £10m debt on the club with the aim of it not costing them a penny. If the community company goes ahead the only two times outside parties would be coming into play is if fresh investment was needed as the company needed capital (to plug gaps or for expansion/ investment in infrastructure or the like) or if the club was being so financially successful it was an attractive proposition for vultures to come calling (which would mean the business was working). I liken the situation we find ourselves in to that of an employee (the fans) who are very good at their job and their employer (football club owners) who run that business badly. What this need to give the club to 'potential purchasers' down the line is saying is, we are good at our job and could run this business better than the boss but we don't have the conviction in our ability to go it alone and build our own successful business with the greater rewards that would have. I also read people saying a community run club would fall behind others as it wouldn't be able to start splashing cash on players. Firstly I don't want PFC spending what it can't afford, even if Richard Branson wrote the cheques and said he didn't want a penny back, because the club would just suffer again when the 'prop' money ran out. I'd also argue that Pompey are just one of many many provincial clubs who will find the culture of football club ownership shifting. With government intervention and UEFA wanting more sustainable structures to clubs coupled with less and less money men willing to throw money at the game, I think you'll find football clubs working within their own means becoming the norm in future years. It wouldn't be a case of community club's battling to keep up, it would be a case of badly run clubs going down the community route. The set up for the Trust's scheme is a co-operative that anyone can join. If it can get up and running and become a success story more will want to be involved and it would snow ball. There's lots of ifs and buts down the line, but I really do think it's time football fans trusted themselves as a body of people with a myriad of skills, business acumen etc to have the confidence in themselves to be the owners of the club and not think we need to rely on any outside investor who may have money in the bank. Gaydamak Jnr had money, it was his old man's gained through iffy business but he had money as well as his own list of failed ventures as long as your arm. Having money and being good businessmen don't always go together and football clubs seem to out the ones who have blagged their fortune. Lets not underestimate ourselves from the off that we the fans can't do a better job than those who went before, after all we don't have to do too much to begin to better all that's gone before us.
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